Episode 18 - The “discomfort” Zone
EMbracing Your “Discomfort” Zone
You know, among the most cherished traditions in Buddhism is the embrace of what is known as the “Beginner’s mind.” This concept encourages us to approach experiences with freshness, curiosity, and devoid of preconceptions—much like a novice. In the context of online dating, this mindset invites us to embrace the discomfort zone as a playground for growth and discovery
This approach encourages you to view each encounter not through a lens of skepticism or self-doubt, but with curiosity and openness to new possibilities. This fresh perspective can transform the online dating experience from a chore into an adventure. It's about seeing beyond the imperfections and embarking on a journey of rediscovery. This mindset shift can turn the act of meeting new people online from a source of anxiety into an opportunity to learn more about yourself, what you truly desire in a partner, and how you can better contribute to a fulfilling relationship. Remember, it's not about having the perfect profile or meeting the perfect person right away, but about giving yourself the chance to explore, grow, and eventually find someone who resonates with your authentic self. Every swipe, every conversation is a step towards understanding what brings you joy and connection. And that, in itself, is a beautiful beginning.
To help us understand this, I’m joined today by Cindy Hopper, an Atlanta-based therapist specializing in life transitions. Cindy shares profound insights on embracing change and stepping out of comfort zones in the realm of online dating. Highlighting the growth found in discomfort, Cindy encourages adopting a beginner's mindset to navigate dating with fresh perspectives. She emphasizes the importance of repetition and resilience in overcoming fears and biases, advocating for the power of intentional living and self-discovery in crafting fulfilling relationships and life chapters post-divorce. Cindy's approach intertwines professional strategies with personal anecdotes, offering actionable advice for those seeking to reinvent their romantic journeys.
This week’s Guest Co-Host
Cindy Hopper
Counselor & Therapist
Cindy is a Counselor with years of experience helping women grow through difficulties such as relationship betrayal, divorce and grief. She focuses on strengths, empowering clients to emerge with grace and dignity. Cindy calls Atlanta home where she also runs a weekly Divorce Wellness Support Group.
Find her at:
Transcript:
Hoyt
Hoyt - 00:03
This is Behind the Swipe, the podcast that takes you inside the lives of real men and women over 40 who have taken the plunge into the often murky and sometimes exhilarating world of online dating. Each week, we explore new topics through the experiences and expectations of real online daters just like you. I'm your host, Hoyt Prisock. Join me as we peel back the one-dimensional dating profiles to discover the real men and women behind the swipe. Welcome to Behind the Swipe. This episode is all about embracing your discomfort zone in online dating. I'm your host, Hoyt Prisock.
00:51
You know, among the most cherished traditions in Buddhism is the embrace of what is known as the beginner's mind. This concept encourages us to approach experiences with freshness, curiosity and devoid of preconceptions, much like a novice. In the context of online dating, this mindset invites us to embrace the discomfort zone as a playground for growth and discovery. This approach encourages you to view each encounter not through a lens of skepticism or self-doubt, but with curiosity and openness to new possibilities. This fresh perspective can transform the online dating experience from a chore into an adventure. It's about seeing beyond imperfections and embarking on a journey of rediscovery. This mindset shift can turn the act of meeting new people online from a source of anxiety into an opportunity to learn more about yourself, what you truly desire in a partner and how you can better contribute to a fulfilling relationship. Remember, it's not about having the perfect profile or meeting the perfect person right away, but about giving yourself the chance to explore, grow and eventually find someone who resonates with your authentic self. Every swipe, every conversation is a step towards understanding what brings you joy and connection, and that in itself is a beautiful beginning.
02:28
To help us understand this, I'm joined today by Cindy Hopper, an Atlanta-based therapist specializing in life transitions. Cindy shares profound insights on embracing change and stepping out of comfort zones in the realm of online dating. Highlighting the growth found in discomfort. Cindy encourages adopting a beginner's mindset to navigate dating with fresh perspectives. She emphasizes the importance of repetition and resilience in overcoming fears and biases, advocating for the power of intentional living and self-discovery in crafting fulfilling relationships and life chapters post-divorce. Cindy's approach intertwines professional strategies with personal anecdotes, offering actionable advice for those seeking to reinvent their romantic journeys. Cindy, welcome back to Behind the Swipe. I'm so happy to see you here today.
Cindy 03:23
Thank you, hoyt. I'm honored to be back. I enjoy this process, I enjoy the podcast and this is a great discussion.
Hoyt - 03:30
One of the reasons that I thought this would be perfect for a discussion with you is that in the last season, the episode that you helped co-host, I found it really encouraging for people, particularly when you talked about your experiences after divorce going back into the dating world and how you framed that for yourself.
03:54
So, I encourage anybody that hasn't heard that episode to go back and listen to it. I'll put the link to that in the show notes for this one. But today I want to talk about getting out of your comfort zone in online dating. For most of our audience, they are, by definition, really making a change. They're seeking a romantic relationship, someone to potentially partner with in the world, and that's a big change and that's part of a really a plethora of changes that are happening to someone who is in midlife. They've maybe gone through a divorce, things are beginning to leave the house, whatever the situation is right. So talk a little bit about that kind of situation, because in your counseling, you work with a lot of people who are in these transitions.
Cindy - 04:48
Yeah, that's my specialty change and first you put it out there but you're great just as you are, you don't need to change. This is true, and it's true that change can be good for you, that the growth process, the edge of our growth, is discomfort, and that discomfort means there's something new happening in us. If we know what we want to change, that helps us live more intentionally. So, yeah, change is so valuable in that topic of discomfort that precedes change.
Hoyt - 05:24
So we're going to talk about this in the context of dating, but it happens really throughout our lives and, as you just alluded to, no intentional change that you want to affect in your life comes without friction or discomfort. At least that's growth, right? That's the growth part of that.
Cindy - 05:45
Absolutely.
Hoyt - 05:46
That change. It put me in mind of a situation where and honestly I think, cindy, it was kind of an epiphany for me when this happened, when I was about 50 years old. I was always kind of nerdy and intellectual book kind of guy from high school and college and really into my career and not really a jock right. But like every kid, I grew up playing baseball in backyard, playing basketball, playing on the church basketball team, all that kind of stuff until I had a bike accident wrecked my knee when I was like 12 years old and that just took me completely off the Athletics track. However, I love basketball. I just I love playing basketball, I love watching basketball, I just love the art of the game.
06:41
And when I was about 50 years old I Said you know what? I Would really like to play basketball, but I'm not very good at it. Right, as a matter of fact, I'm pretty terrible at it and because I haven't played, I can intellectually understand how the game works. But the but the physical piece of Making that pass, knowing who's gonna be weird and positioning yourself, I didn't know any of that stuff. So I had found a local midday older guys league at the boys and girls club in Bellevue, washington, and I Just I threw myself into it. I said okay, I am really uncomfortable, I'm gonna embarrass myself. These people aren't gonna want me back.
07:30
They are not gonna want, nobody's gonna want me on their team right as one of the as one of the five and I found that when I showed up Vulnerable like that, I was 100% embraced by that entire group of people and, no, I was still not any good. It became a really important part of my world, not only in just a playing basketball, but in the Connections that I made with the people that I was playing with and they're embrace of me, and the life lesson that I took from that is that maybe Getting into my discomfort zone Was something that I should actually see Instead of resisting.
Cindy - 08:19
Yes, yes, I love that point. It's funny because, as you're saying that, one of the things that came to mind was the repetition of doing it Wasn't just the first time. You went back and you went back and it reinforced it and it reminded me of learning to ski. I grew up in Idaho and didn't ski, but my sister did all the time. I didn't realize I was an outdoor girl until I was in my 40s. So I had moved to Alaska and I thought, okay, I was 30, now is the time I'm finally gonna learn to ski. And I called my sister and she said you have to do it at least three times. You can't do it once and decide so.
08:51
In our community there was a school offering of three sessions of ski lessons at Alyeska, a beautiful resort. It like provided the skis and the transportation, the lift tickets and instruction, and I was like I'm signing up, that's it and doing it. It was for ages eight to 99 and so I'm like all right, I mean I got through the first day. I Was the only adult. Everyone else was between eight and ten years old. First of all, I was horrible, I kept falling and I mean it was humiliating, I mean, but I put a smile on and kept going and faked it and Going home that day I remember thinking I don't want to go back, I don't want to go back, and I called my sister and she said you said three times, so all right, I'll go back and by the third time you know I'm not an expert skier but I was skiing down the slopes and feeling the fresh air on my face and breathing in the crisp air. It was beautiful. I'm so glad I tried again.
Hoyt - 09:49
I love that story, cindy. Let's talk about why people want to stay in a comfort zone. Let's bring it back into the online dating world, particularly the first time that you're anticipating, you know, you say, well, I'd like to meet somebody and and apparently Mr or Mrs Mrs Right is not going to just randomly show up at my door unless you have a really hot UPS guy or something like that. Maybe that'll happen. So maybe your friends now convince you that it's time for you to try to get online, but there are a lot of forces or rave that psychologically Keep you from making that leap. So what? Let's talk about why that Comfort zone is a safe place. I mean, I don't like especially on cold mornings, I don't like getting up out of bed and taking the covers off to start my Day. My comfort zone is on the pillow, but I know I'm not gonna do anything done unless I get up out of bed, right? So let's really yeah, so.
Cindy - 10:52
So that's so interesting because we are wired to resist change, mostly because Our brains which are just fascinating, our brain is so fascinating Seek safety and comfort. We are always looking for danger. We have a negativity bias built in and that helped us survive. We don't need that as much now for physical safety, but for emotional safety. We really rely on that aspect of who changes dangerous and we don't tell ourselves changes dangerous. We tell ourselves that new situation is dangerous, that thing I might want, I'm not gonna do it that way because that's dangerous. I've seen bad things happen. So we get caught in the rut of looking for you know we call it confirmation bias Looking for the things that have happened that are bad, looking for the experiences our friends have had with dating that did not turn out well, looking for experiences where our friends told us oh my gosh, it takes a lot of time, the shopping for humans is exhausting. We kind of get caught up in that in an effort to keep ourselves safe and not change.
Hoyt - 11:58
And so that's an easy thing to do. I guess the first thing we ought to get off the table is there are legitimate risks and there are ways that you should be concerned and take precautions and take care of yourself Physical safety, for example.
Cindy - 12:13
Now shall I tell you how I kind of tackled that, and not everything that's out there, but I do have strong opinions. One, my adult daughter. When she found out, I talked to her about it and she said don't get in the car with anyone. It's like fair enough. The other thing I did was I let people know where I would be when I was meeting someone, and they always met them in a public place and I always asked for an online presence, I think that having either their LinkedIn or even a Facebook or something online. And I would kind of make a joke of it and say you know, men worry that she doesn't look like her picture. Women worry about dying, you know.
Hoyt - 12:52
Yeah, yeah.
Cindy - 12:54
I never have anybody push back on that, yeah, and I would send the link to my friends. So this is where I'm going to be tonight. This is who I'm with.
Hoyt - 13:06
It sounds like you're being just very conscious about those things, and once you were able to say, yes, I've got a plan for that, then you could let go of that right. And I remember you talking about some of your dating experience where you would say, look, I'm getting to meet new people right and in framing it, where the bar isn't oh, this could be my person right?
Cindy - 13:34
Yeah, exactly, do I want to be friends with this person? Is this someone I would want to be friends with? And you know, we were told when we were young that best relationships, partner relationships come from being friends first. We're a great concept we can still have if we're sitting across the table from them thinking is this my life partner? Oh, hell, no. On that first meet we're awkward, we're so uncomfortable. We're not ourselves, they're not themselves. That's why I also say get a second meet. The first one's a meet, not a date. Always get a second one to see if you're both more relaxed before you make judgment.
Hoyt - 14:12
That's interesting, or whether it's positive or negative, right, I mean, unless it's a clear. I guess there are a few.
Cindy - 14:18
If it's a clear wedge flag, no need. There were a couple of those where I was like okay, good enough, but almost every one I dated online. I did a second meet with.
Hoyt - 14:27
And so let's talk about the other manifestations of this comfort zone, because, like you said, we're all wired that way, right, we're all wired to be in our own comfort zone, and there's a difference, I think, between and this is maybe a critical difference that you can speak to here there's a difference between accepting the possibility of discomfort and actually embracing that to go in.
Cindy - 14:55
Oh, I love that so much. Embracing discomfort. There's an idea that Adam Grant shared about leaning into the discomfort, choosing to actually take on something uncomfortable. I did it when I started running. I didn't start running until I was 40. Choosing that pain, reminding myself that muscle pain is the muscle breaking down to build up again, choosing the pain of getting up in the morning, hoit humiliation with a year old's being Choosing, that is so valuable in so many areas of our lives, because we get out of that mindset that the world is dangerous and that we can't succeed, and we get out of our limiting beliefs by actually choosing discomfort.
Hoyt - 15:40
All right. So in dating, what are some of the things that people tell themselves that are really just ways that they're trying to stay in their comfort zone?
Cindy - 15:51
Oh yeah yeah. I talk to a lot of people I know about this, and the biggest one was time. It's going to take so much time and mainly it's going to take so much time that's going to lead to nothing. I don't know Anybody who has a successful relationship. All of my friends had really harrowing experiences or weirdos. It's just going to take too much time. I don't want to do that.
16:14
Another common theme was rejection. I'm not going to put myself out there. I'm not photogenic, I don't like my weight right now. That's what men are looking for. I don't want to be criticized. How could I possibly do this? I don't want that rejection. That's not worth it.
16:29
And the other one was not just dating weirdos but potential risks of danger. So risks of danger I mean that's an important one and you have to say okay and take the safety measures. And once I take the safety measures, what is the percentage of likelihood that something dangerous is going to happen to me? And really evaluate. Be honest with yourself, because it's easier to ruminate and get caught up in that anxiety about danger and then, with the other ones, say what if? So I put myself out there and I spend a month going as many dates as I can on a month. What if nothing comes out?
17:09
Okay, answer your question what if? And then, if that happens, what if that happens? And if that worst thing happens, what if that happens? And really get down to crystallize what the problem is. If you are not at your ideal weight and you go out there and you meet someone and you can tell that they're rejecting you, what if then? And what does that mean to you? And then what about that belief? What if? What if? What happens? Then you can also just say I like to say the word end With a question, yeah, but limiting belief and yeah.
17:45
Then what? Yeah, so there, I don't want to deny that those things are frustrating and those things are scary and that the big discomfort of Putting ourselves out there and maybe being embarrassed or or the feeling of shame is very real and Humiliation is very real. And yet those are feelings we can sit with and really analyze. When we have those experiences, they are such great opportunities for growth, to learn about ourselves, to learn about the experience. What did I learn from the state? What did I learn and I'm not saying learning, oh my gosh, I need to lose weight before I need anyone no, no, no. What did I learn about my thoughts about myself and whether or not I'm enough?
Hoyt - 18:29
So it makes sense and what a great way to read. I mean, this is about reframing it, right in a lot of ways if you understand what that discomfort is and you push through it anyway, understanding that the worst that could happen is you learn a little bit more about you. You learned a little bit more about the kind of people that you respond well to out in the world, right.
Cindy - 18:56
Right, exactly, exactly so it's an education and the way you connect with people. What's comfortable, I realize, for me, I don't really like sitting across from a table with someone I don't know trying to make a conversation. We may have had winty bad banter online, but in person you may not happen as easily. That's why I always, you know, you know, if you don't make a plan to meet up within three days of communicating, move on. You need to meet in person. But but understanding ourselves to that helps us understand what do we really want? And and Taking some quiet reflection in that, when we've had a lesson that we've learned, what is it that I really want? What am I really asking for and how do I get that? How do I make that connection?
19:41
I learned that I really liked going for a walk with someone or, you know, in a public place or doing an activity where we were more side-by-side. I feel like sometimes sitting across the table from someone feels confrontational. So Getting a cup of coffee and going for a walk, you know, and 30 minutes, 45 minutes. When I met my husband, I had an hour time in between dates and I was on my you know date. As many people as I can for 30 days. See how that goes. It's just a learning experience, it's just practice. You know, then, the more practice you get, the better you get at it. Which?
Hoyt - 20:23
in your personal experience then, Cindy, that Education that you got will help you understand the things that were really important to you in a new relationship.
Cindy - 20:35
And you know what else. It helped me not be so nervous when I met someone. I have a good friend I mentioned her in our previous episode who I was single long before me and she said if you catch me going an online dating site, I want you to chop my fingers off, you know? And and she laughed, which you heard me refer to her. So, sorry, friend, here we are again.
20:54
And so she, more recently, in the last she had tried it a couple years ago and then backed off a little and then decided you know, it's time. I am busy, I've started this new career, I've got a lot going on, I haven't moved, but I'm gonna do it. And so she really dug in and she set up a profile and she got some professional pictures and some pictures that were fun and Started dating online. And in the meantime, as she was learning about that and meeting people, she was in a bookstore and A man started talking to her Guess who she's in a relationship with now that meeting England. It was much easier because she's practiced being with the opposite sex after being single for many, many years. She got some practice from online dating so that when she met someone that was interesting it didn't feel so nervous, except for she still gets a little bit of aided before their date and that's fun. But yeah, so many people say, oh, I want to do it organically. But you can do both.
Hoyt - 21:53
Well, it's like people say about like interviewing for jobs right, if you're interviewing for a job, you're not gonna set up the one that you really want, right? Exactly you do some practice interviews, right?
Cindy - 22:08
And you can find as you practice, right. That's what the practice dating is about. You were fine and you were fine. You were fine your profile, you know. You just get it out there and then refine it and work through it. I changed mine many times and I was on several dating websites and Experimented, because that's really how we learn.
Hoyt - 22:24
Yes, all right, it's probably a really good time for us to take a quick break here, but in the second half of the show I'd like to discuss the broader implications of this comfort zone of Just life-wise, and then let's get into some specifics about somebody that's feeling Like there's a pressure on them Internal pressure to stay in their comfort zone and not out, and some of the Specific techniques that they can use to move on. So we'll be back with Cindy Hopper in just a moment. If you're enjoying behind the swipe, I have two very specific ass of you, and exactly none of them will cost you a nickel. If you haven't already done so, please subscribe to our weekly newsletter here. You'll be the first to know about upcoming episodes and how you can participate, along with the tips and links to the stories and posts about online dating that I've found interesting To do. So I'm going to show you how to do it I've found interesting to do, so. Just go to behind the swipe calm, wait for the pop-up and drop your email into the form. Secondly, we're committed to sharing this podcast with an even wider audience this year. You can help by following us on Instagram at behind the swipe podcast. I truly appreciate your support and encouragement.
23:50
Now let's get back to today's show. Welcome back. I'm here with Cindy Hopper, and Cindy is a therapist and counselor here in the Atlanta area that's really specializes in change in people's lives and how to Effect that change in a very positive way, and so no more appropriate conversations for us to be having Then. How staying in your comfort zone can be very limiting for your dating life. So we talked in the first part of the show about what the comfort zone is, why we have it, the psychological elements of that, and we got into some of the specifics around how this impacts your dating life Sort of the negative aspects of staying in your comfort zone and how that could impact your dating life.
24:49
What I want to talk about now is that it's not just dating. I mean, this is about. This is a philosophy of life that will serve you in in in so many ways. So if you take it up, people make this assumption that if I'm staying in my comfort zone, that just means I'm staying the same. You made an interesting comment. It's not staying the same, is it?
Cindy - 25:14
It's not saying the same, it's shrinking. It's that thing that we used to say, that we thought was motivational of If you keep doing the same thing, you'll get what you've always gotten. You have to do something different. But if you do the same thing, you won't get what you've always gotten, because what Happens is that gets smaller and smaller, which you've gotten a smaller, smaller compared to everything around you, growing and expanding. It's so funny because when we look at how we want to live our elderly lives, we talk about oh my gosh, my mom is 83. She's doing new things all the time and she'll travel by herself, she sees the world and she's so active. That's what I want to be. Well, that's what we all want to be at some level. We don't want to be the mom that the world gets smaller and smaller and we're living by a very tight, limited set of people that we know and activities we do. That I have seen in my clients does not serve them well and when they get more expensive about change, and it's not always.
26:16
Dating is just expansive about change, because they start to really imagine what they want in their lives. That intentional living is just beautiful. Creating what you want is so powerful.
Hoyt - 26:29
And I guess it's kind of like what you were talking about in the first half of the show, when you were talking about going on a lot of dates, putting yourself into that discomfort zone and having been able to learn from that a confidence and a competence about communicating with people, about how to do this, and so that made you more ready. When your Partner actually came around right, made you more ready.
Cindy - 27:01
It was. It was such an easy, comfortable conversation, not just because he's an easy, comfortable guy to talk to, but because I wasn't racing away with my thoughts and Ruminating and trying to figure out. You know, I wasn't feeling anxious. It's like I'm just meeting this guy. There's no, you know no risk. I'm just meeting him in a public place and you have his online presence. I've told people where I am. I'm not getting in a car with him, all that stuff. So it made it so much more natural. I think that's a beautiful thing.
27:30
You know, when we talk about the cycle of change, it's really interesting because, as humans and you know, psychologists have studied this for a long time in our motivations for change there's the Pre-contemplation stage, where we don't really intend to change. It's out there. So some of us are there with our online dating. It's out there, maybe someday. And then we have the contemplation, which we're aware of what we want to change, but we don't really have a commitment to it yet. So maybe, you know, I might go online dating, but I'm I'm not making plan. Next we have preparation and that's an intent on taking the action, like, okay, I'm actually gonna take an action. All right, I might even tell myself when.
28:14
And then we take the action. That would be setting up our profile right and and maybe Start talking to people online and and then, after that happens, there's a maintenance. That's when we reflect back Okay, how did that go, what am I gonna do differently? New behaviors of being a little more comfortable with meeting people become regular, but what's really interesting is that then sometimes there's a relapse, and a relapse isn't a problem because it's more like, rather than going in the same circle, you're going in an upward spiral. So sometimes I hear people say, well, I did it on the online dating thing when I was younger and it didn't work out. Or, yeah, I tried that a couple of years ago, you know. Or or I had a bad experience, and so, yeah, we might fall back into some of that pattern of not wanting to change, but we don't start at the bottom where we were. We're in a newer place and we start with that pre contemplation again, and then contemplation, and then preparation, action, maintenance and and, as you pointed out with your skiing analogy, it's repetition too right.
29:16
Petition yes, and we learn from each relapse. Each bad date is such a learning experience and it can give us a funny story. You know, we can smile and say, wow, I was really awkward. Or oh, that was not a match, or yeah, oh my gosh. What was my friend's ex husband? They're reached out. That's not okay. Yeah, we learn.
Hoyt - 29:37
So we talked a lot about the comfort zone as a reason why people Aren't putting themselves out there online. Yeah, the hesitation about actually jumping into the online dating pool, but let's talk about the impact. Let's say you are online dating, but your comfort zone is All right. I want to meet somebody with a Country club membership. He's might be an attorney. You have this narrow box that you draw for yourself about. All right, I've created this ideal partner for me, whether that's, you know, based on their characteristics, whether that's based on looks, whether that's based on their profession, whether that's based on their financial well-being. You know, you sort of have this box paint. Well, there's a that's comfort zone too, right?
Cindy - 30:35
Yes, that's. That's also a limiting belief that other things won't work and we'll get inside that box. Think of the things we miss, the beauty in the world that we miss and the friends we miss. How many times have you Realized that somebody you may not have been exposed to any other way than maybe, like a work environment or somebody wouldn't have chosen to be with, turns out to be a really good friend? And, as you know, I say that we're dating to make friends, not to meet partners. Meeting a partner such a lucky byproduct. I think about these opportunities to change too.
31:10
And in the world of psychology there are a couple of different ways of someone like, especially with a phobia or any other kind of fear, we can expose ourselves very gradually to something new dipping our toe in, filling your discomfort, pulling back and then dipping our toe in again, feeling a little more discomfort, getting a little more comfort with it, and then pulling back. And I mean, if you imagine someone who has a fear of spiders, right, they might gradually expose themselves. Or there's an experience where we can do flooding and that is we walk right into a dangerous situation, as dangerous as it can be. Someone's putting a room with a bunch of spiders right, or puts their hand in a box. It has a bunch of spiders, so that we are flooded and experience what we think will be the very worst thing and go oh, okay, I survived that, right, I I know that for myself.
32:01
I dipped my toe in a little bit a couple of times and I Thought about it when I finally just decided to take the plunge. It's like, okay, I'm just gonna do this, I'm gonna meet a couple people. But it was when I tried that as many days as I can in 30 days Like, yes, it's gonna take time, okay, for these 30 days I'm gonna meet as many people as I can, and that's in that one little hour of time in between other things. And the next day I met my husband. So I was flooding myself those experiences so that they were not as intimidating. Now, that is leaning into discomfort. I'm not a social butterfly, I'm quite socially awkward and one-on-one is even harder for me. So I threw myself in. So how did you Make?
Hoyt - 32:44
that shift for yourself. I mean not in the dating world, but just you know to to say, okay, well I, I want to take that same approach More broadly life to Feel more comfortable with the world. I want to feel more comfortable in that awkwardness that I feel and not be, not to let that be a limiting belief.
Cindy - 33:05
Right. I had to assess what I wanted. I Find such value I'll say it again intentional living. I one of the best compliments I ever had was someone who said Cindy lives her life more intentionally than anyone I know and I think, well, yeah, what do we want in our lives? Sometimes it's not clear. We kind of have to sit with that and there are lots of different ways to kind of work through that, through that out. I'm not talking about all the big things and who we want to be in the world, but what kind of experiences do we want and what do we want to manifest? I do believe in manifesting and vision boards and all that stuff Just help get some clarity. So I had to have some clarity on what I wanted.
Hoyt - 33:48
So you had to really create and keep that North Star in front of you, right?
Cindy - 33:53
Right, and then all the social awkwardness was just all right. That's uncomfortable. Can I accept that I'm socially awkward sometimes and I stumble over my words? All right, All right, it's true. Right, you know.
Hoyt - 34:06
But that's just People have heard in life with a bunch of different kinds of situations, right? I mean there are probably nine out of 10 people will tell you that they're not comfortable public speaking, right?
34:20
Just not comfortable public speaking, and part of it is I don't want to be judged, you know, Right, my anxiety level is going to cause me to not even be as articulate as I am in normal conversation. I think about your friend in the bookstore, right? Is that there are people for whom those conversations would be no, I'm going to make this. You know I'm not going to engage here because, I'm not comfortable with that right.
Cindy - 34:51
Yeah, yeah, oh my gosh, what's he going to think of me? What's it going to be like? Does he want something from me? You know all the things that go on in our minds that hold us back. So overcoming fears is so real.
35:05
We often look at, like, especially the public speaking example of someone who's a great public speaker and think, oh my gosh, I can never do that. But then when we really learn about them and learn what went into that, oh, it's been a long history and I know that most of the listeners have heard of Adam Grant. He's a great psychology speaker and writer about motivation and change and he was having a conversation on a podcast with Jay Shetty which was really interesting, and he was terrible at public speaking. Like he thought of doing that that there is no way. I know he goes around in lectures and he has so much information that he shares Just the process of overcoming something like that that we assume everybody else is really good at that. Oh well, they're really natural at dating. They're really good at meeting other people. They, you know, whatever. We all have our stories, we tell ourselves about other people and then when we really get to know them, we're like, oh, they got that way through practice.
Hoyt - 36:01
I see Uh-huh, uh-huh.
Cindy - 36:02
Yeah, that doesn't happen in a natural way, if this is, and we are not born knowing how to date, but we're born knowing how to connect with people and how important it is right. It's never too late to be what you might have been, and I've had rare pivots in my life and I remember that, oh yeah, it's never too late. I want to try something. Yeah, I'm like, well, I may as well try it. I don't have to do it forever. This is just the next thing.
Hoyt - 36:27
Perfect. So I want to in a minute I want to wrap up with some specific action items that people who have this hesitation around getting into the online dating world, what kind of tricks they can use to help themselves get through that. But before we do that, you had mentioned that you got a new group being organized. That sounds like it's got a fascinating mission to it and I was hoping you'd talk about that a little bit.
Cindy - 36:57
Oh, I would love to. It's called After the Dust Settles Life After Divorce. So I have a divorce support group and it is such a beautiful thing to see these women connecting and reaching out to each other and helping each other through the tricks of actually getting through the divorce and the details. And then a lot of women get to the point like, okay, well, I'm still coming, but that's not exactly meeting my need. What's next? And I had been just kind of tossing around this idea and so now I'm setting up a new group and it's kind of like okay, the bonfire is over, what do I do with the ashes? We all go through hard things. Now what? And I'm really excited about that. We have some specific topics we're going to talk about and we're going to explore and it's more of a processing group and an internal processing of who do we want to be and how do we get there, and exactly like this what are our limiting beliefs that are preventing us from being and living the way we want?
Hoyt - 37:55
So if the prior work was really around understanding the trauma and dealing with that radical change, this piece is really about the more aspirational elements of it. Right, about how, the remaking right, the phoenix rising.
Cindy - 38:14
Yeah, we are more than a forest. You know, that is one experience of our lives. That's not the experience of our lives, it shapes us. The difficulty for many women I know in my group is that they become something better and more powerful and learn about themselves in ways they had never expected or never wanted. And then what?
Hoyt - 38:38
Yeah, what's yes, and then what Right?
Cindy - 38:41
right, it's like you were working before, and and and exactly Right.
Hoyt - 38:48
So let's bring this back to some actionable items for our listeners that might have some of these hesitations. Let's talk about a few of them. Oh, I'm not quite ready yet. Things aren't perfect, right, I'm carrying around a little too much weight. You know I might have kids In life's night perfectly aligned for you, and yet you're still feeling that desire to meet new people and maybe find that someone out there. What?
Cindy - 39:20
are some of the things that they can do. I think, I think really reevaluating what perfect looks like, you know, okay, so when your kids are out of the house and you're at your goal weight, you have the wardrobe you want, you have a great mindset, then you're ready, man, don't we learn and grow as we go along and meet people? Don't we have lots of options? And so are those fears real? Are those time concerns, kid concerns? Absolutely they are. Can they be overcome? Absolutely, you know. Get professional pictures. I used to joke that being told I was photogenic means that I look better in pictures than I do in real life. Why be photogenic? Why not show up and say, wow, you look better than your pictures? Get out there, refine, refine, refine. Get professional pictures. Do some activities in your life that are enriching and rewarding, so that you have things to talk about, so that you have other ways of being and relating to the world.
Hoyt - 40:26
Tell me about crafting your own little support group, right? You know that that's what you want to do and you know what your concerns are about getting out there. Oftentimes I think, look, if you have people that you care about and that care about you in your life and many of us are fortunate enough to have that is it not the right thing to do to co-op them and tell them I need your support to do that, because you don't have to do it all alone, right?
Cindy - 40:59
Right. Right, and what's so interesting is, even as we're setting up our online profiles, having other eyes on it can be helpful, but too many eyes, we get too much information and you can assess, okay, what's the theme of this information I'm getting? What's the theme of these criticisms or people in our lives can be cheerleaders and not really think clearly, but, as Adam Grant says, rather than asking for feedback, say what's one piece of advice you would suggest I change on this profile. What do you think? And then when we and he talks about then we get a lot of responses and watch for the theme. I think one of the most helpful things is to have a couple of people in your life who can look clearly at your profile or just share what speaks to them, especially if you know someone of the opposite sex, who's a friend, who's online dating, ask them Show me three profiles that really stand out for you. What is it?
41:54
about that profile Not necessarily. What about mine? Because that feels like. I remember the first time I shared that with a friend and she was going to share it with single male friends and get their feedback. I was like, oh my gosh, I feel so exposed to showing it to a friend. I don't mind showing it to strangers, but showing it to a friend was like, oh, this is embarrassing. So yeah, just, you don't even have to share your own. You could ask people what do you look for? What do you look for in an online profile? What pictures speak out to you? Show me what you think.
Hoyt - 42:25
And so, coming back to the worst thing that could happen, like you would talk and I'd love for you to talk a little bit more about this as we wrap up here but really understanding these barriers that you're putting in, but essentially putting them to the test, and there are techniques around that, aren't there?
Cindy - 42:45
Yes, there are Putting things to the test and really figuring out what are your thoughts. One of the things I always recommend is doing a brain dump, so like suppose you come home from a date, you get a lot of mixed feelings and your brain is looking for dangers, looking for all the bad things that happened, reinforcing your confirmation bias that this is. I'm not good at this. This is not a good idea. It's not worth my time. So do brain dump right Everything that comes to your mind, even if what's coming to your mind is like I don't know what to write. Just do that for a few minutes and then look at it and say, well, what thoughts are true and what thoughts are helpful? What would I rather be thinking? And reevaluate those thoughts, because it's too easy to stay in our confirmation bias and our echo chamber about what's wrong instead of what's possible.
Hoyt - 43:37
And so you would just encourage people to just feel the fear and do it anyway, right, right?
Cindy - 43:43
Right.
Hoyt - 43:44
Don't push the fear away. I mean, that's okay, that's a part of what helps you work and what helps you process things and take care of yourself.
Cindy - 43:53
Right, that is exactly the edge. The edge of growth Is that discomfort. That's the edge. That's how we grow.
Hoyt - 44:02
Cindy, this has been so great having you here. I really appreciate it. But before we go, I want you to remind people how they can reach out to you and maybe learn a little bit more about your practice and your group.
Cindy - 44:14
Sure, I work at Atlanta Center for Wellness. It's in Sandy Springs and I have a divorce support group there. But, as I said, I am also starting a life after divorce support group where we examine intentional living. I'm a psychotherapist. I accept clients. I particularly like working in transition and change and I work with couples and a lot of aspects. I think humans are just fascinating, the human mind is fascinating, and it is so satisfying seeing people pivot and shift and grow. That is very, very rewarding to be able to witness. So, atlanta Center for Wellness, cindy Hopper you can find my bio there or reach out to me at Cindy at hoppercounselingcom.
Hoyt - 44:59
Fantastic. This has been so great. Thank you again for being here. I would encourage everybody that's dealing with some of these things to reach out to Cindy because, as you know, she's just fantastic. I love her.
Cindy - 45:13
And I leave it just one thought. It's really a quote that has stuck with me for a long time If we're never afraid to be a beginner, the whole world opens up to us.
Hoyt - 45:24
I love that Perfect way to end this.
Cindy - 45:26
All right, thank you, wade.
Hoyt - 45:32
I want to thank Cindy once again for sharing her insights, personal experiences and her advice. Just as in our favorite films, where the hero accepts a difficult challenge but emerges stronger from their trials, so too can we navigate the virtual wilderness of online dating in the second half of life, With guides along the way like Cindy Hopper, illuminating our paths. Embracing the discomfort zone becomes less about the guaranteed outcome and more about the journey of self-discovery and growth itself. It's in facing these challenges and stepping into the unknown that we find our string and, ultimately, our triumph. This is your story and you are the hero. I'm your host, Hoyt Prisock. Until next time, swipe fearlessly.