John: 0:00

My wife passed away in 2021. I'm pretty much a lone guy. Stayed to myself, stay busy. And a year later, this rock. My daughter, said dad, you gotta get out there. So I just kind of chuckled. And here I was, 79 years old.

John: 0:17

I started realizing that you know, I might've been a little lonely. So I figured, oh, the only way I would've got out there is a dating site. Chasing the gals in the bars wasn't my thing. So I went on to Silver Singles. After I signed up and paid whatever fee it was for six months, I was very short and quick to the point. So the next morning I had 125 e-mads Over the whole time that I was there, I had probably 40 dates, but to tell your listeners I would say good, after a try it.

Hoyt Prisock: 1:33

This is Behind the Swipe, the podcast that takes you inside the lives of real men and women over 40 who have taken the plunge into the often-burkey and sometimes exhilarating world of online dating. Each week, we explore new topics through the experiences and expectations of real online daters just like you. I'm your host, Hoyt Priceock. Join me as we peel back the one-dimensional dating profiles to discover the real men and women behind the swipe. We all know the stereotypes. Once you pass 50, the love train has left the station.

Hoyt Prisock: 2:16

Romance and dating is for the tender generation. In the second half of life, you're advised no expected to pour your passion into volunteering, golf, pickleball or the worship of grandchildren, and the mainstream media generally reinforces that narrative. Like children, the older generation are expected to be seen and not heard, and preferably not seen at all. If you're in or approaching your later years, you've probably experienced this, and I'm not here today to rant against ageism. I'm not even here to proudly declare that 60 is the new 40. Yes, it's true that if you're older and in good health, chances are you feel 20% younger than your driver's license proclaims, and that youthful energy applies not just to physical and intellectual pursuits, but also to the search for meaningful romantic relationships as well. Television and films have been almost blind to this energized population of so-called senior citizen Until now.

Hoyt Prisock: 3:33

Today we're going to talk about ABC's newest reboot of the long-lived bachelor franchise, the Golden Bachelor. Despite the sometimes kitschy and formulaic elements of this reality TV show, something important is happening. Older men and women are being shown for who they really are wise, funny, thoughtful, caring and, most of all, just like the rest of us, longing for the most basic of needs love and companionship. I have been waiting for an opportunity to do this episode because I have been watching the Golden Bachelor, having never watched any of the bachelor programs before.

Hoyt Prisock: 4:19

It was a new experience for me and I found it fascinating in so many ways, and some of you listeners of ours had sent to me a blog post that was posted on Medium about the hopefulness that the program embodies, and that blog post was written by Sherry Jacobs, and I reached out to Sherry and I said hey, Sherry, come on this program, let's talk about the Golden Bachelor. So I am so pleased to have Sherry Jacobs with us today. Sherry is the author of the Friendship Diet. I'm going to get you to talk about that in a little bit here. She is a voiceover actor, she is an actress, she's a blogger and she works in education as well. Sherry, it's a pleasure to have you here.

Sheri Jacobs: 5:08

It's a pleasure to be here. Hoyt, Thank you for having me. I was so floored when I heard that you were interested in hearing more about the thoughts behind the Golden Bachelor from my perspective.

Hoyt Prisock: 5:22

You were telling me you're 50 years old, right yeah, and you are yourself a single mom, and so you may or may not be involved in the online dating world, which is where most of our listeners are involved.

Hoyt Prisock: 5:35

Somehow they're 40s, 50s and beyond, and they're dating online, and so what I thought was fascinating about this program was that, for the most part, people over 50, especially in media are put aside.

Hoyt Prisock: 5:53

They are extras essentially to the story and dismissed in a lot of ways, and here was really the perfect opportunity to highlight not only the energy level, the enthusiasm, the caring and the intelligence that these people are bringing with their lives, but also contrasting that with a lot of what goes on in media today, which is a little bit of plastic, right Like putting on an air. And these people I didn't see that right, Especially the bachelor, Gary. He was totally authentic to me and I felt like, well, this is a person who's really in touch with his own feelings and embraces the fact that he's got some age on him and he's living his full life here, and I just found that really exciting. But I wanted to share it from you because you were inspired to write about this and I want to hear about how you came up with this idea to write a post about the show and what it really meant to you.

Sheri Jacobs: 7:07

Yeah, I was never a big fan of the original bachelor, but I am in a relationship with someone and he, over the years, has said oh, watch the bachelor with me, watch it, watch it. And I'd watch it and I'd want to vomit because there wasn't any depth to it. And so he said watch this, watch this. And I said I don't know if I want to watch this. And he said it's different, you'll see, you'll see. So we watched it together. He knows me so well. I was very open-hearted about it. It gave me hope. It gave me palpable hope to see, as you said, hoyt, these dynamic, vital, intelligent men and women who were willing to be vulnerable. Not that the original Bachelor of Women weren't, but I think when you have youth on your side, your motivation for meeting someone might be not as pure always as it is when we're older.

Sheri Jacobs: 8:19

I read something on Medium said I'm aware at this age I'm paraphrasing that the sands of time have moved on the other side of the glass, and I just thought that was so profound. And I think when we are older, whatever older is, whatever we perceive not what society deems, but what we perceive as older you realize the clock really is ticking. It's a wake-up call. And so you're less likely to embark on a show like that, where you really have put yourself out there, unless you have genuine, pure motivation. And, like you said about Gary is putting himself out there. They all, they just want love, and isn't that what everyone wants? We all wanna know we matter, we all wanna have that sense that we belong to someone special.

Sheri Jacobs: 9:17

But I think when we get older and this is what attracts me to the show it becomes a lot more distilled and apparent, as opposed to when we're younger, where we're just like fresh peaches off the vine. You know, I remember myself in college. I was a hottie. I was like you're good, you're good, I'll go out with you. I'll go out with you because you're getting all this attention and you don't even know where to look first. And then suddenly you're the other woman you know like, yeah, not that, not that lady, the one next to the old lady, the hot one you know.

Sheri Jacobs: 10:00

So your perspective shifts, so does the show.

Hoyt Prisock: 10:04

Yeah, I agree with that, and I think that they've gotten past that point where they hear that much about what society really thinks. Right, which is a beautiful thing. Right, because it allows them to expose who they really are in ways that maybe they couldn't have done in their 20s, 30s and 40s. Right, they just couldn't have done that.

Sheri Jacobs: 10:25

I also admire their humanness. This is an article that will be coming out shortly I'm working on it now from yesterday's. But the vulnerability that still pervades us, even when we have a very different looking exterior than we did at 20. And the articulation and the awareness of that vulnerability that comes with it. One of the women, leslie I don't know if she's 65 or 70, she is so good. Every episode now she says things that are very aware of what she's feeling Like when she didn't get picked on the talent show we saw in the last episode, in yesterday's episode, and you see her acknowledging her hurt that she wasn't chosen, which is a very normal human emotion. But simultaneously and this is maturity she's able to say but I'm very happy for Joan who got picked. To be able to hold two conflicting emotions in your heart is a wisdom that the world needs to see. What a great model for people in their 20s and 30s.

Hoyt Prisock: 11:38

I absolutely agree with you. As a matter of fact, I wanted to share with you a little bit of an interview that I did with a woman named Fiona. And Fiona is older than the bachelor that's on the show, but she has so much energy and so much enthusiasm for life that I just thought, all right, I've got to talk to her for this episode. So let's hear from Fiona. I started out by asking her about her age and where she was in life. I'm 80. You know, I'm old.

Fiona: 12:13

I finally can say I'm old but I'm not gonna let it have me. It can't have my life. I still want to be able to do it. I don't want my life. I really want to delve into some of these things. Everything I've read says that enthusiasm comes from living life fully. So maybe I just came into the world wanting to live life fully.

Fiona: 12:38

My husband and I were wonderful friends and we loved each other deeply, but we were not good partners and so we divorced after 20 years, which was hard on the kids. But we were such good friends that we stayed friends and raised the children together and did holidays together when that worked. With his new wife. We stayed friends until he died five years ago Really close friends. We talked a couple of times a week and I was on matchcom for 25 years and they kicked me off because my credit card ran out and nobody told me what's up. I went into an old column. It was gone. I have a group of rice girlfriends 12 of us but about half the group is in the same place. I am Enthusiastic about life and still going at it, and the other half I don't know. They just gotten quiet. I'm going to squeeze the last bit of juice out of my portion of life and I can squeeze.

Hoyt Prisock: 13:45

So you mentioned being on match 20 years ago or so Tell me how relationships with men differ today than they were for you 20 years ago.

Fiona: 13:57

Oh, really, really, really different. I'm different for one thing I decided I was going to learn to do intimacy, which means telling my truth, and I didn't do that 20 years ago I did what I was taught to do, which was to let the man have the sort of superior position, although verbally I would tell you that I didn't believe that was right. But to have a relationship it was necessary. I don't have a relationship right now. It may be necessary, but my truth is my truth and I've learned to say it nicely. And you know, when something bothers me, I can say it very nicely.

Fiona: 14:50

And if somebody can't do that, a lot of people, especially men of my generation they just don't know how to do it. Not that they can't be taught if they want to be, and I don't mind teaching some I mean, I'm a therapist so I teach people that intimacy all the time but we didn't do that much back then. We didn't do that much in most of my life. This is a thing of the last 20 years that we've started focusing on more intimate ways to communicate Wow.

Hoyt Prisock: 15:27

Sherry. She brings up some really interesting points and the first thing that stuck out for me when I was asking her about these men that she was dating that were in her cohort, right, right, many of them are still sort of stuck in that 1950s and 60s kind of mentality, kind of an inherent patriarchy kind of thing. Right, there's dominance and subservience kind of roles that were common back in the day and you can feel that she's moved past that and her complaint is that not many of these guys have really moved past that. Well, darryon Michele clearly has moved past that.

Sheri Jacobs: 16:09

He had us. But at the same time, I will say he's just as kind and compassionate as ever. And he's human. We're all flawed, I mean, we're all imperfect, and that's where compassion reigns supreme, right Compassion for ourselves and compassion for others.

Sheri Jacobs: 16:28

There was some verbiage that came out of him that I was like come on, Gary, you're a. But he didn't realize it. I don't think he was cognizant of it, but there was a scene where one woman I'm not giving anything away she says thank you for picking me. She's gushing, she's so happy she got picked, and that was making me cringe Because I don't even need to explain it right. And then, Jerry, I'm not giving anything away, but he says you earned it. It made me nauseous. I call them vomit moments, but we all have vomit moments and the fact is that if someone were to point that out to Jerry and the woman, their behavior, they'd say oh no, let me mean it like that, Because we all have that 1950s, 1960s virus in us. It's getting more diluted with each generation. But we have to be vigilant. We're human, we're a product of our environment. How many times do you get to your office and you wonder how did I get here? It's muscle memory, right.

Sheri Jacobs: 17:43

And the same is true for the way we behave. We can consciously say, just like Fiona said now, I'm not like that. But even she said but there are times where I would speak up and say this is wrong, this is the patriarchy, but I would do something that contradicted that.

Hoyt Prisock: 18:04

Or go along with it anyway.

Sheri Jacobs: 18:06

Yeah, go along with it anyway.

Hoyt Prisock: 18:07

Clearly we're all enjoying the people on this show. You very much. But I think we have to say that the premise is a little bit. You know much to believe, right? Well, first of all, nothing works that way in real life, right? Oh, it's like no, you don't get a budget.

Sheri Jacobs: 18:28

You don't get a mansion, you don't get cameras on you. There's the ring and I think there's a certain personality spectrum that is attracted to being in the ring. Like that I don't have that. The concept itself is distasteful to me, that you're going to market your love life out there but at the same time just you know you can have more than one feeling at a time, just like we were talking about at the beginning. I have so much respect for them putting themselves out there, giving a face and personality, personalities to people after a certain point of life on earth.

Hoyt Prisock: 19:10

Well, at the end of the day, the show is a game show, right? It's like, yeah, and it's intended to be entertainment and it is. It's very entertaining right, yeah. But the underlying premise is that all of these women would automatically accept whoever the producers choose as a bachelor to have some kind of an intimate relationship with. Well, you know, there's chemistry that would have to be involved. You don't know whether you're even going to be attracted to that person, right?

John: 19:44

Right.

Hoyt Prisock: 19:45

So in the real world there would be people who would not accept the rose from Gary. He said thanks, good luck to you. You're a sweet guy, but you're just not my guy, right, right. And that's not going to happen, I think largely because they're all pre-selected for willingness to go along with the entire premise.

Sheri Jacobs: 20:10

Right, and I believe that the end they have to. It's understood that there's a potential for engagement to get married. That's not something I would sign up for, because you can't compartmentalize and put love on a time slot. You know Eastern Standard Time once a week, Right, right?

Hoyt Prisock: 20:31

In concentrate form right.

Sheri Jacobs: 20:33

In concentrate form, right, and that's the other thing. We're only seeing the parts the producers want us to see. Of sure a ton is edited out.

Hoyt Prisock: 20:43

One of the reasons again that I wanted to choose Fiona for this episode was that I saw in Fiona the same kind of enthusiasm and just a life affirming force from them that I see in a lot of the women there. So who among those women do you really resonate with? Who are you seeing out there that say, oh, I really feel like this is the genuine article out of all the women, ellen, the one from Florida. Oh, right, yeah, Um. And.

Sheri Jacobs: 21:18

I think he's most attracted to her. And we evolve, you hope, as we age. And he even says again, no spoilers, but she puts on a gown and he said you know she looks beautiful. I'm paraphrasing, but it was her smile that lit up and I'm so attracted to her sense of humor. You know, life is so serious If you can't laugh with someone. At the end of the day, I mean, that's what we really want.

Sheri Jacobs: 21:44

When we're young, we look at that surface of things like, oh my God, honey, it's so cute and we both like the same colors, you know. But over time we want to be able to connect with someone because of the life we've lived, and humor is a wonderful antidote to pain. It's a wonderful balm to any kind of trauma or challenge that you've had at some point in the slings and arrows of life. But Ellen, I just adore her because she's so genuine. I mean, out of anyone else she's really. She has no angle. Where's the other women? You know there's like a very beautiful. You know she has great teeth, she's a wedding planner and I'm like you know a lot of them, like they're on and you could feel in this episode again, no spoilers, but I'm sure I won't shock you if I tell you that the green monster emerged in this episode.

Hoyt Prisock: 22:45

Oh, good, good, a little bit of that anyway, right.

Sheri Jacobs: 22:49

Well, it wouldn't happen. Because they're older, with more experience and wisdom, doesn't mean they're not human. You put anyone, I don't care, I'm being that situation, god, like you were like, I thought you wanted me, I thought I mattered, I was feeling your connection. Like normally, people who are dating don't go home and say, hey, let me tell you, I know you're interested in him, so am I, as you know, and we're in competition. It doesn't work like that. So they've been put in a very abnormal situation.

Sheri Jacobs: 23:24

That they chose to put themselves in and so, like you said when we did the beginning, this is entertainment, but it's a fascinating psychological study and a fascinating opportunity to market people 50 plus, 60 plus, as people who are no longer invisible unless it's for erectile dysfunction.

Hoyt Prisock: 23:50

Exactly right, or any of the other pharmaceuticals that.

Sheri Jacobs: 23:55

Right, they're not wearing cardigans and handing out where there's originals.

Hoyt Prisock: 24:02

They're turbocharging those walkers these days, you know.

Sheri Jacobs: 24:05

You know there is luck to your health. They're. Genetics play a role, but 90% of life is your attitude. And what a wonderful opportunity to see. You'll see what they do on this show. I'm like you go, girls. You go Like yeah.

Hoyt Prisock: 24:24

So this is probably a good opportunity to take a quick break. When we come back in the second half. I want to hear a little bit more from a recording that I've done with Fiona, where I asked her about how she would advise herself of 20 years ago and men of 20 years younger than she is, and then Sherry, I want to talk about what this might mean culturally going forward and what barriers this might be breaking. So we'll talk about that when we get back from the break. A couple of weeks ago, I had the pleasure to attend podcast movement, which is the annual Podcaster Conference that occurred this year in Denver, colorado. I had the opportunity to meet a number of podcasters who are doing great work. They've become friends of mine and I want you to listen to some of their podcasts. So today I brought on one of my favorite people, wendy Green. Wendy hosts a podcast called hey Boomer. Wendy, tell us about hey Boomer.

Wendy Green: 25:29

Hey Boomer is a show for those of us who believe that we are never too old to set another bowl or dream a new dream. I talk to guests from all over the world about changing their lives, the transformations that they go through, some of the adventures that they take. We learn about health and dimension and dating and all kinds of things that are interested people that want to stay active and involved and engaged in life well into our 60s, 70s, 80s and beyond.

Hoyt Prisock: 26:00

And you've got how many podcasts now?

Wendy Green: 26:02

I have 156 podcasts now.

Hoyt Prisock: 26:04

Whoa, congratulations. Thank you, hey Boomer. It's available wherever you get your podcasts and her site is online at heyboomerbiz. So we are back on Behind the Swipe, and today my guest is Sherry Jacob. Sherry is a writer, she is an author, an actor and she's active in education. So welcome back, sherry. It's great to be back here. Voight, thank you. I can't wait to begin with some of this stuff.

Hoyt Prisock: 26:32

But before we do that, tell me about this friendship diet book that you've written. I want to hear about that. Well, thank you for asking about it. The long title is the Life of a man.

Sheri Jacobs: 26:42

Thank you for asking about it. The long title is the Friendship Diet Clean out your fridge, get real with yourself and fill your life with meaningful relationships. That last. The epiphany behind it was the divorce of my husband, and I found myself using phrases in my head like I'm hungry for connection, starving to feel like I matter. It was a toxic relationship that I just couldn't digest.

Sheri Jacobs: 27:17

I thought it's interesting how these ideas about food and nutrition and emotion are percolating in my mind and I thought, well, there's something here to explore, and writing has always been therapeutic for me. So I just decided I would write something no different than a blog post, like the Bachelor, and I started writing when Are my Empty Calories? And I noticed that same as quote by Einstein kept coming to mind insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results. So my 20s and 30s were spent just. God forbid. I was alone. I always had to have someone. I went from one monogamous relationship to another and I didn't explore the inner terrain of my heart or, in this case, my fridge, my emotional fridge. So the book is a series of vignettes about this analogy, this metaphor between emotional nutrition and edible nutrition, identifying the empty calories in our lives.

Hoyt Prisock: 28:34

People can find the book at Amazon or on your website.

Sheri Jacobs: 28:36

Amazon, amazon, amazon, our medium on my website.

Hoyt Prisock: 28:39

So let's talk about the Gold Bachelor again and to tee that up, fiona was talking about some of the opportunities and challenges that she was having and, given her perspective from 80 years old, I wanted to ask her what advice she would give to her younger self. This is what she said.

Fiona: 29:03

To be yourself. That's how you attract people that fit with you. If you're dating men who keep going away, they're not the right people for you. You haven't found your tribe. If you be yourself, you attract people. Then I have a prospect right now. But you attract people that like living out in the open, who like being themselves and can relax around other people and just be who they are.

Hoyt Prisock: 29:43

That's great advice.

Fiona: 29:44

It's harder than it sounds, but every day you can make another little step toward being who you are. What is it you want? What is it you need? Knowing your needs and asking for them is really important.

Hoyt Prisock: 29:58

And does that advice? I mean clearly that applies to both men and women.

Fiona: 30:03

It does.

Hoyt Prisock: 30:05

But what specifically would you say to men in that situation? Because you've got some experience in what they are in art doing, right?

Fiona: 30:16

Well, so many people have a list 10 things, 20 things, 30 things that I want in a partner, and they go by the list. Men tend to be so much more visual and the right person may be beautiful inside and not so much on the outside, but love brings out beauty in everybody, and so give it a chance. Give it a chance, you know.

Hoyt Prisock: 30:46

So broaden the horizons, try not to.

Fiona: 30:48

Broaden the horizons. Yes, yes, oh my, they're really, really broad. But then that's what sevens on the Enneagram do, right.

Hoyt Prisock: 31:00

So, sherry, what do you think about that advice? I saw you nodding there.

Sheri Jacobs: 31:04

Oh, absolutely, and I love how Fiona acknowledges that's not always so easy, you know, because life gets you, you can end up down the rabbit hole. But, like she said, it's taking those steps every day, checking in with yourself and saying what do I want, what do I need, and articulating those needs, because otherwise we end up in that echo chamber and we end up having a fight with our partner or a potential someone, and they weren't even in that conversation. That was all you in your own head.

Sheri Jacobs: 31:37

And you laugh, we did you know, we've all done it.

Hoyt Prisock: 31:40

Absolutely.

Sheri Jacobs: 31:41

Yeah.

John: 31:43

Because it often turns.

Hoyt Prisock: 31:44

If you're in a conflict like that, you've already done two-thirds of the battle in your own head, right.

Wendy Green: 31:53

Exactly.

Hoyt Prisock: 31:54

So you're coming at it and you're trying to bring this other person in like two-thirds of the way into the whole logical process, right Impossible.

Sheri Jacobs: 32:04

Impossible, I think, articulating your needs and the way we've articulated our needs, not in a mean way, but in a hey, this is me, this is what I need, and giving the other person space to have their reaction and also the beauty from within. God willing, with time on earth, those cracks are on the surface of us and we're going to form more foundations. If we can't appreciate the essence of a person, then you're falling for a mirage and you're not doing anything for either one of you involved.

Hoyt Prisock: 32:41

I think, with both Fiona and the contestants on the Golden Batch, work they all well. I don't want to say all, but for the most part they've reached this phase where they let go of feeling like they have to conform to some societal expectation, and I think a lot of that comes from look, I'm accepting aging here, and what was it that I was even holding on to in the first place?

Sheri Jacobs: 33:14

right and so and you can see how freeing that is in these women, and freeing for Gary too, and that's what I was hearing from Fiona- and I do think it's a paradigm shift, going back to before the break, when Fiona was sharing about that 1950s, 1960s patriarchal mentality that we're still seeing strands in modern times, but they're dissipating and we're catching ourselves more. But with that also is the idea of what age looks like. We have changed the face of aging. I remember my grandparents. I remember thinking they were old, just like ancient, and I'll look at pictures of them and it's like, yeah, you were old, not because they were old in chronological years they weren't, maybe they were in their fifties, maybe sixties, but they assumed the position you know we're just going to burn on that mo-mo.

Sheri Jacobs: 34:20

The way they carried themselves was so dark. Even if they were happy, there was a seriousness to them that was just-.

Hoyt Prisock: 34:30

Right, right, and it was kind of a resignation right In a lot of ways-.

Sheri Jacobs: 34:36

Yeah, that's the perfect word for it. It was a resignation, Like well, this is it.

Hoyt Prisock: 34:44

And I think the contestants, the people that they're highlighting on this show, indicate that it doesn't have to be that way. When Fiona was talking about her friends say well, look, half of them are like me, they've got this zest for life, they're over-scheduling themselves because they want to drink it all in. And the other half? It was interesting how she said that. She said that they're getting quiet. They're getting quiet.

Sheri Jacobs: 35:12

You brought that up because she said so many great things and you forget they're getting quiet. It's such a polite way for us to infer between the lines. It's the resignation it's the depression.

Sheri Jacobs: 35:29

I see it with my mom. She's 79. Beautiful woman. I keep pushing her to watch the Golden Bachelor to cheer her up, but there's this resignation about her. I think you can have that at 30. You can have it at 80. You get to decide. I love the way Fiona described it. I want to drink the last drop, I want to squeeze it. This life is a gift. They've done studies that your perception creates your reality. If you tell yourself, oh, my God, I have a tickle on my throat, it's going to become a cough next week, I'm going to have to take off work the following week, it will matter as fast as likely. Whereas if you say, okay, I have a tickle on my throat, whatever, it's probably allergies You're much more likely to get over whatever that little thing was. Attitude creates behavior.

Hoyt Prisock: 36:30

Behavior competes itself 100% Back to the stage here. So much of the media that we experienced today is trying to usher older people off the stage. Oh, let's make room for the next younger, beautiful generation, and fine, you don't have to fight that, but you don't have to accept that either, and that's what's affirming, I think, about the Golden Bachelor. So, sherry, is this any kind of a watershed for media in a way that might permanently change things, or at least change the tack here and show that these people are still as active, and sometimes more active, than their younger cohort?

Sheri Jacobs: 37:18

I definitely think so. When you look back at the Golden Girls, right, we had a little peak of like oh, they're living together, they have all these great relationships, but they still were. If the woman who played Blanche Devereux, she was in her early to mid-40s, what Wolfish?

Hoyt Prisock: 37:38

And even on the show they were in their mid-50s or something right.

Sheri Jacobs: 37:44

But they were behaving like they were go get them 80.

Hoyt Prisock: 37:50

I know they were playing it as if they were well gosh, this predates you. But like the Beverly Hillbillies, like Granny on the Beverly Hillbillies, you know they were kind of no, but I know the reference.

Sheri Jacobs: 38:01

No, absolutely, that's a great, great example. Yeah, estelle Getty. She was much younger than the role she played. We've come a lot farther since then. That show would not get off the ground now for good reasons. I think this is, like you said, a watershed moment. I really do, and anytime you have a watershed moment, you get strong reactions, and I have gotten strong reactions from people on medium, everything from I don't know, I'm celebrating women to how could you say that this objectifies women? Okay, you know you can objectify in both tenders if you really want to go out like that. I mean, he's objectified as the handsome 71-year-old. You know you put yourself out there, you're objectified, done, whether you're 10 or 100,.

Sheri Jacobs: 38:57

You're objectified as soon as you go on TV, but I know that those kind of comments means I've hit a nerve and there's something underneath there, and that's when we grow as a culture. Why is this hurting? Why is this hurting? What is that? What's that?

Hoyt Prisock: 39:17

about yeah, what is that reaction from Right? That's a little bit deeper reaction than you would normally expect.

Sheri Jacobs: 39:25

Yeah, yeah, it was the same with the Barbie movie, right? Why are we reacting this way? Well, because it's beyond the humor and entertainment. You're talking about gender roles and you're questioning those gender roles, so you can say all you want about how I'm a blonde and blah, blah, blah, blah. Then why are you having such a hard time with seeing these powerful women in their 70s and 80s? If you were to say to me, Sherry, you have great brown eyes, and I would say, well, thanks, but they're blue. If you kept insisting my eyes were brown, I wouldn't get angry with you because I know my truth. But when we have a culture that's in transition and you present the hope of the Golden Bachelor, you're going to get reactions because it's hitting a nerve on the pulse of society. Are we ready to embrace this idea that men and women after a certain age are vital, sexy, intelligent, powerful people? Yeah, I wish I could talk to you about the third episode, but you haven't seen it because I wanted to bring up an example of that. But I'll hold off.

Hoyt Prisock: 40:39

Well, do it. I mean, by the time we air this, everybody will have had an opportunity to do it.

Sheri Jacobs: 40:45

Oh, okay, okay so there was an episode where I think her name is Joan, she was chosen and she's heading it off with Gary Really sweet, they're great, everything's wonderful. She gets a call or a text, rather from her daughter that her daughter really needs her. Her daughter had given birth a couple of weeks before and had a C-section, so she doesn't want to leave because she knows that means his attention's going to be diverted somewhere else. So I talked about this with my boyfriend and he said I think Joan should never have even been on the show because she knew her daughter was giving birth. That should be her priority.

Sheri Jacobs: 41:28

And I said, well, I disagree. I feel that she's entitled to be a grandmother, be there for her daughter, and she's entitled to be on this show. And he said no, it's selfish. And I said, well, you know, that's your opinion. And I disagree. And I think just to be able to have these conversations are healthy, because we're not going to always see on the same page as our partner. He feels I'll change my mind someday, god willing, if I become a grandma. First of all, I would never want to be on the show.

John: 42:04

So you know.

Sheri Jacobs: 42:05

But I say, why not? Like, yeah, she was there for her daughter's birth. She left and now she's gone. She should never have been there. So I think whenever you have a show like this, you're going to have judgment, and I think that's what life's about. These are growing pains of society, these ideas.

Sheri Jacobs: 42:25

you know, because my boyfriend is 57 and he grew up with the man and the woman are home, and I'm 50 and I grew up with a much more liberal. Let people do what works for them, as long as they're not hurting someone. I don't care. Your childhood upbringing affects your belief in where a woman's place is, including the grandma, because, as a woman, I thought well, of course she should be able to pursue this with this man. She gave up her all the good, all those good years raising kids. This is her time to finally have time for herself. But he didn't see it that way.

Hoyt Prisock: 43:07

He said this is our time to be a grandma. All right, you could make the argument that it wasn't her that was being selfish. It was the daughter.

Sheri Jacobs: 43:15

You could absolutely yeah, yeah, because I would tell my mom, like, go and have fun, like your own national show. You go girls.

Hoyt Prisock: 43:26

Yeah, I mean this is a once in a lifetime opportunity for these people in a lot of ways.

Sheri Jacobs: 43:30

Exactly, yeah, exactly.

Hoyt Prisock: 43:33

You can make that statement about a grandchild. They're going to be around.

Sheri Jacobs: 43:37

Well, that's just it, and I think it's just this kind of conversation surprised me. When I think it surprised my boyfriend. I think he was like, well, obviously she shouldn't have even tried to be on the show. And I'm like, well, obviously, if she wanted to be on the show, she should be on the show and we're not going to break up over it, it's just being willing to have those honest discussions with someone. Yeah, I think that is a micro of what's going to go out on in the world with the show.

Hoyt Prisock: 44:14

So, sherry, it sounds like you were surprised to have enjoyed the Golden Bachelor as much as you did. Yeah, like, tell me about your expectations going into it and then where you ended up and what surprised you about your own reaction.

Sheri Jacobs: 44:32

I assumed it would be Hollywood making fun of older people Like, oh, that's so cute. You remember in the wedding singer? I thought it was going to be like that and instead it has considering. It's a reality, Hollywood based TV show. It has gravitas, it packs a thought provoking punch and, yes, there are shallow moments, especially as the show goes on. And again, the people tuning into this are not living in a political miscommunity and so they're not used to this idea of one man and all these women.

Sheri Jacobs: 45:19

It just it's rife with drama and that's what sells in Hollywood. So that is going to be regardless of age. But I do like that the older demographic is getting airtime that is not devoted to derogatory. Oh, that's so cute. He can't get into a bathtub without a special hand holder. You know, I do like that these women are entering talent competitions that we saw in episode three and they're terrified to perform some of them and they're like you know, I'm going to do it, and they put themselves out there and they say things like I'm still here, I'm still alive, and their talents ranged as much as their personalities and you see them jealous. They're human.

Fiona: 46:15

That just makes them bad.

Sheri Jacobs: 46:17

That makes them real. It's part of the human condition. So guess what? That doesn't go away with age. You just learned how to honor it. I guess, handle it. You're not throwing a temper tantrum on the floor anymore, but maybe you are inside, I don't know. That's the point. There's even a quote from Joan, who gave up being with him to be with her daughter. She's in the limo getting sent back and she says because as you get older, you become more invisible. People don't see you anymore, like you're not as significant as when you're young.

Hoyt Prisock: 46:55

And that's so true, and maybe this program helps to nudge society a little closer to making sure that everybody's visible.

Sheri Jacobs: 47:05

Everyone. Yeah, this is not to bash young people, and to boost up older people is to say I love what you said. Wait, it's all of us. Everyone matters, everyone deserves air time.

Hoyt Prisock: 47:19

Well, listen, I want to thank you so much for joining me today, Sherry, and before we go we've been talking about this I will put all of the links to your blog posts and to your website and to the book in the show notes, but remind everybody how to find you on medium, how to find your website and how to go get the Friendship Diet book.

Sheri Jacobs: 47:43

Thank you. Thank you, wait. Friendship Diet can easily be found on Amazon. So just put in the Friendship Diet, sherry Jacobs, it'll show up Any reviews, even if they're bad. I just want honest reviews. So that helps. That algorithm helps other people who need it find it. The other place you can find me is on medium. You would put in Sherry Jacobs and I would come up S-H-E-R-I, j-a-c-o-b-s, like Mark Jacobs, the rich designer. No relation, but I'm open to it, and then Sherry-Jagabscom. Those are the places Yup.

Hoyt Prisock: 48:26

Well again, sherry, this was so fun. Thank you for coming and sharing your insights about this and your enthusiasm about it. I've had just a great time.

Sheri Jacobs: 48:35

Same here Hoy. Thank you so much for having me, and I will definitely let you know when the next medium article on the Bachelor is out.

Hoyt Prisock: 48:43

Oh, I've already followed you, girl, so I'm going to get it right when it loads. Oh my God, I'm so honored.

John: 48:47

I'm so honored.

Sheri Jacobs: 48:48

Thank you.

Hoyt Prisock: 48:51

Thank you very much. I really enjoyed hearing Sherry's perspective on so many of the complex issues brought to the fore by the Golden Bachelor. While the old adage that you're only as old as you feel rings true, it's also true that it's never too late to find the kind of love and companionship that can bring so much richness to life, and to see that message find its spotlight in the mainstream media is very simply a joy. Thanks again to Sherry Jacobs and to our anonymous daters, john, whom you heard earlier in the show, and Fiona I'm your host, hoyt Price-Ock. Join us again next week for another episode of Behind the Swipe. Until then, swipe fearlessly.